Post by Sweet on Jul 7, 2016 11:24:19 GMT
It's implied that Angel knew about Spike and his soul (and about Spike and Buffy) when he met Buffy in Chosen and 'smelled' him on her. But is it really so?
While looking out at some quotes in ATS, the ones where Angel and Lilah talk before he makes the deal about taking over W&H and Connor, the mind wiping etc I realized something. Lilah was obviously informed about what happened in Sunnydale. Is it believable that she knows nothing about Spike? I mean, another souled vampire surely is a big thing, W&H must know about it!
ATS 'Home' 4x22
So, Lilah has a dossier about Sunnydale and I'm pretty convinced that there is everything in there, included Buffy's involvment with Spike, which isn't really a secret for anyone lol. Of course, Angel doesn't read the file here. he obviously has other things in his mind, and he quickly dismisses the idea of going to help Buffy. Apparently he doesn't care and believes she doesn't need his help (and that would be a first!). But we know that he then changes idea, because in Chosen he personally goes to Sunnydale to deliver the amulet. He could send someone but he didn't. He has so many things to deal with in LA: Cordelia, Connor, his new 'job'. But he leaves everything to do something he previously didn't care to do. Question is: what made him change idea? I think he later read the file and learned about Spike, about the soul, about Spike and Buffy.
This would explain his going to Sunnydale and most of all his smooth attitude when he talks with Buffy about Spike. All his behavior always irked me. What, he smells Spike on Buffy and just like that he jumps to the conclusion that she is having an affair with him? That he is her boyfriend? That's just absurd. Wouldn't it be more logical on his part to think that they had been fighting? If he doesn't know that Spike has a soul and he doesn't know about what happened between Spike and Buffy in s6 to believe, just like that, that Buffy and Spike are more than enemies really has no sense. And his meek reaction has no sense too!
He smells Spike on Buffy, instantly thinks that she has had sex with Spike, an evil soulless vampire... and this is his answer? He doesn't go mad? He doesn't start yelling and asking questions? he just goes on smiling and making jokes? Un-be-lie-va-ble.
And I don't buy that W&H would risk their most recent 'purchase' sending him to wear the amulet. I'm not convinced that they (or Angel) didn't know about the amulet side-effect, but even so as Angel himself said they knew it was 'probably very dangerous'. So why would W&H let Angel do it when he had just accepted their deal? No, I think that Angel never intended to be the one to wear the amulet, he offered yes, but he had to know that Buffy wouldn't accept his offer and he very easily consented... and that's another first! Because really, whenever did Angel care about what Buffy wanted? Whenever did he do what Buffy asked? And let's not forget that Angel is very good in manipulating people, he has 200 and more years of experience in this. So he knew all along that Buffy would send him away and that Spike would be the one to wear the amulet and that's possibly what W&H wanted all along.
I'm also convinced that Angel going in Sunnydale, his easy going attitude, his hinting to Buffy that they could go back together (conveniently forgetting that all the reasons that supposedly separated them where still there) was simply a way to stake his claim on Buffy. Much like he did when freshly sired Spike babbled about him and Drusilla being forever and he purposefully had sex with Drusilla and let Spike catch them. Angel didn't want to be with Buffy but didn't want Spike to have her either, as he showed later on ATS when he refused to let Spike contact Buffy: "She is not mine, but she is not yours either". And he went to Sunnydale to prove it.
While looking out at some quotes in ATS, the ones where Angel and Lilah talk before he makes the deal about taking over W&H and Connor, the mind wiping etc I realized something. Lilah was obviously informed about what happened in Sunnydale. Is it believable that she knows nothing about Spike? I mean, another souled vampire surely is a big thing, W&H must know about it!
ATS 'Home' 4x22
LILAH
(smiles) Maybe. While you've been namby-pambying around for the past 90 seconds, 6 innocent people have died. Oh, but don't worry. There's always 6,000 more just around the corner or up the coast. (hands Angel a file)
ANGEL
(opens the file, reads) Sunnydale. (takes out an amulet from the file)
LILAH
That nifty, little bauble comes with the file. Apparently, it's crucial for some kind of final battle. Guess they're in short supply up Sunnydale way. A bit gauche for my taste, but, hey, not a slayer.
ANGEL
(puts the amulet back in the file; throws it on the table) Buffy can handle herself.
(smiles) Maybe. While you've been namby-pambying around for the past 90 seconds, 6 innocent people have died. Oh, but don't worry. There's always 6,000 more just around the corner or up the coast. (hands Angel a file)
ANGEL
(opens the file, reads) Sunnydale. (takes out an amulet from the file)
LILAH
That nifty, little bauble comes with the file. Apparently, it's crucial for some kind of final battle. Guess they're in short supply up Sunnydale way. A bit gauche for my taste, but, hey, not a slayer.
ANGEL
(puts the amulet back in the file; throws it on the table) Buffy can handle herself.
So, Lilah has a dossier about Sunnydale and I'm pretty convinced that there is everything in there, included Buffy's involvment with Spike, which isn't really a secret for anyone lol. Of course, Angel doesn't read the file here. he obviously has other things in his mind, and he quickly dismisses the idea of going to help Buffy. Apparently he doesn't care and believes she doesn't need his help (and that would be a first!). But we know that he then changes idea, because in Chosen he personally goes to Sunnydale to deliver the amulet. He could send someone but he didn't. He has so many things to deal with in LA: Cordelia, Connor, his new 'job'. But he leaves everything to do something he previously didn't care to do. Question is: what made him change idea? I think he later read the file and learned about Spike, about the soul, about Spike and Buffy.
This would explain his going to Sunnydale and most of all his smooth attitude when he talks with Buffy about Spike. All his behavior always irked me. What, he smells Spike on Buffy and just like that he jumps to the conclusion that she is having an affair with him? That he is her boyfriend? That's just absurd. Wouldn't it be more logical on his part to think that they had been fighting? If he doesn't know that Spike has a soul and he doesn't know about what happened between Spike and Buffy in s6 to believe, just like that, that Buffy and Spike are more than enemies really has no sense. And his meek reaction has no sense too!
*ANGEL*
(pulls back from the kiss) Well, I guess that qualifies as "happy to see me."
(pulls back from the kiss) Well, I guess that qualifies as "happy to see me."
He smells Spike on Buffy, instantly thinks that she has had sex with Spike, an evil soulless vampire... and this is his answer? He doesn't go mad? He doesn't start yelling and asking questions? he just goes on smiling and making jokes? Un-be-lie-va-ble.
And I don't buy that W&H would risk their most recent 'purchase' sending him to wear the amulet. I'm not convinced that they (or Angel) didn't know about the amulet side-effect, but even so as Angel himself said they knew it was 'probably very dangerous'. So why would W&H let Angel do it when he had just accepted their deal? No, I think that Angel never intended to be the one to wear the amulet, he offered yes, but he had to know that Buffy wouldn't accept his offer and he very easily consented... and that's another first! Because really, whenever did Angel care about what Buffy wanted? Whenever did he do what Buffy asked? And let's not forget that Angel is very good in manipulating people, he has 200 and more years of experience in this. So he knew all along that Buffy would send him away and that Spike would be the one to wear the amulet and that's possibly what W&H wanted all along.
I'm also convinced that Angel going in Sunnydale, his easy going attitude, his hinting to Buffy that they could go back together (conveniently forgetting that all the reasons that supposedly separated them where still there) was simply a way to stake his claim on Buffy. Much like he did when freshly sired Spike babbled about him and Drusilla being forever and he purposefully had sex with Drusilla and let Spike catch them. Angel didn't want to be with Buffy but didn't want Spike to have her either, as he showed later on ATS when he refused to let Spike contact Buffy: "She is not mine, but she is not yours either". And he went to Sunnydale to prove it.
